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MOOCs: Evolution and Revolution Part 3 - History

coverIn Part 1 of this post, I wrote a bit about the MOOC as revolution and an evolution. In Part 2, I wrote about the background of my wife, Lynnette, and myself that led us to contribute a chapter, "MOOCs: Evolution and Revolution," to the book, Macro-Level Learning through Massive Open Online Courses (MOOCs): Strategies and Predictions for the Future.

In this post, I want to cover a bit of the pre-history of the MOOC. It's a backstory that encapsulates how distance education developed into online learning.

Distance education dates back to private correspondence courses that were offered in advertisements in the Boston Gazette as early as 1728 by Caleb Phillips.

The University Of London was the first school to offer its degrees worldwide in 1858.

College courses were also offered by radio in the 1940?s and were incorporating television in the 1950s. 

In the 1960s and 70s, movements in education, especially at the pre-university level, such as the use of manipulatives in mathematics and the open classroom movement, suggested models for a learning process that was more student-centered, but was still controlled by the teacher.

In 1969, Open University was established in the UK which again used radio and television to deliver courses.

The technology of the 1980s and early 1990s allowed course materials, now including recorded lectures, to be mailed to students on VHS videotapes and CDs. If the learning appeared ‘student-centered’, it was mostly because the teacher had no way to direct learning other than to give assignments and make due dates. My wife and I both took courses in this enhanced-correspondence" mode. 

?Lynnette used the video series French in Action (FIA) produced by Yale University and WGBH Boston in collaboration with Wellesley College which used a set of over twenty VHS tapes that were paid for by her school district. The series gave the illusion of being interactive since the actor/professor spoke directly to the camera while teaching and then cut to video clips from television and movies for use as reinforcement examples that appeared to be happening live, very much in a soap opera fashion.  There was also a simulated class of students who would sometimes interact on the television screen with this professor and there were times when the television audience was asked to participate by repeating or pronouncing. Once again there were inklings of the potential for future ways to teach, learn, connect and collaborate outside the physical classroom. 

Instructional Television (ITV) emerged next as a way to offer lectures and content. These licensed channels could deliver live or pre-recorded instruction to multiple sites within a school district or to branch campuses at universities. This was considered synchronous communication or instruction because, though it could be prerecorded, it was often used "live" from several locations. In the late 1990s, NJIT offered several courses from campus for advanced high school students via ITV in a "dual enrollment" manner. The sessions could be integrated into the distant classroom setting and often included teachers’ guides that could help with the use of the program in the remote instructors’ lessons. 

It was not until 1998 that the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) permitted two-way operations which created the potential for instructional material to be interactive with the program and the learner. This allowed for course offerings in schools where not enough students were enrolled in a course in order for it to run independently. The school would provide funds to connect via satellite to a host school and this two-way communication along with a teacher facilitator allowed students to ask questions and hold discussions with their host in real-time.

The early days of the Internet are what transitioned distance learning into online learning. The use of ‘the Net’ added a number of new elements and greatly facilitated the delivery of course content. The paper mail or ‘snail mail’ that had been a key element of the correspondence model of distance education for a century was transformed by ‘electronic mail’ (email). Many online courses were, and still are, asynchronous, meaning that communication took place outside of real time and there was a lag between the message sent by the learner and the response to it by the instructor. It was also private and not visible to the entire body of students.

There became opportunities as bandwidth increased to stream video and have synchronous (live) lectures, meetings and discussions through mediums such as video conferencing and Skype. Probably the most significant addition was the ability to conduct online discussions. This became possible through the programming provided by online learning management systems (LMS) in text message fashion similar to cell phones. There was still a lag in that not everyone would be ‘logged-in’ at the same time, but the discussion could be followed and thoughts could be added or ‘posted’. Adding and following posts or threaded discussion moved some of the control away from the teacher, and it finally increased the ‘student-to-student’ interaction that had always existed in the physical classroom.

Still, many online courses remain textbook-based and the relationship between teacher and student often remains the most important even though it is online. 

In the United States, between 2002 and 2008, the number of classes being taken online rose by 187%. In 2009, over four million students were taking some type of online course. In 2013, one in four Australian students, or about 298,000 were learning off campus (Lepi, 2013).

This was also a time when social media began to make a greater impact on courses both online and F2F, as teachers began to use it as a part of the design of their courses and students used it to create their own Personal Learning Environments (PLE), a topic which will be described in a separate section of this chapter. 

Large-scale, free online education, Open Education Resources (OER) and open courseware have a longer history than MOOCs. Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) OpenCourseWare was initiated as a new way to disseminate knowledge. They also saw this as a way to create a shared intellectual commons or Open Access (OA) in academia to foster collaboration across MIT and among other scholars. OA is online, free of charge, and removes most of the price barriers and permission barriers for use of material. This was the most difficult part of the process for the university to work out.  There were logistical challenges of ownership and intellectual property for items within the course materials as well as technical challenges of converting materials to an online format. Nevertheless, in September 2002, the MIT OpenCourseWare site opened to the public with 50 offerings.

However, these are not considered courses or MOOCs because there is no teacher, facilitator, discussion forum, assignment, feedback, grades or record of any work completed. Possibly, part of the message with this project was that having access to MIT materials did not equate with the value of actually getting credit for an MIT course.  This initiative, however, could be perceived as the precursor to the MOOC.

MOOCWhen the term MOOC was coined, it was not simply meant to be Massive Open Online Course. Here are some of the parameters that highlight the distinctions.

Massive implies numbers as well as diversity. Much of what has been written revolves around the growing number of participants in online learning, but there is yet to be a discussion that includes diversity and the global impact of these initiatives.

Open(ness) alludes to free: free for registration, free for operation, free for materials, free for participation, free for sharing, open syllabus, open space for multiple threads of belief co-existing in a course. The first pure MOOCs were considered ‘open’ but in two different respects. First, they were open enrollment to students outside the hosting university – an ‘open registration’. Open registration resulted in enrollment becoming massive, hence, the numbers. Second, the materials of the courses were licensed using Creative Commons (CC) licenses so that their materials could be remixed and reused by others, as in ‘open license’. The amount of materials and their uses became another incarnation for the term ‘massive’. 

Online has been the core of the discussion as evidenced so far in the chapter and there are massive amounts of changes borne by the changes in technology. 

Course redefines the structure of content being applied to the Internet, its scalability and the pedagogy used to make it a good online class. 

While maintaining these four elements, the ‘purpose’ behind a MOOC has had a significant impact on their evolution, creating different types. For example, we saw the term "xMOOC" to stand for extended. It lays out common ground in a field with opportunities for self-remediating. It is more teacher-centered. An xMOOC tends to have the largest number of enrollees. Most courses offered by the major suppliers (Coursera et al) fit this definition. 

The "cMOOC" came to mean "connectivist," where people can fail together, work together, even cheat together with open research; the connectivism of working on something in the open with people who have a common interest which can help one see clearer. The discovery of common interest leads participants to band together within the MOOC itself to learn the things they want/need to learn. The first courses labeled as MOOC were built in this design and were much more student-centered. 

We also saw the term "vMOOC" used to distinguish vocational offerings. There are companies using their influence to create courses that their employees, clients and service providers can learn from and use to improve their skill levels. It gives people a chance to break into a field of knowledge. They tend not to be open in enrollment or in the open sourcing of the content. They may have a cost to enroll.

An interesting bit of history we came across in our research was about James J. O'Donnell  who wrote in The Chronicle of Higher Education in 2012 “I think I taught the first MOOC in history. It was the spring of 1994” He was referring to a standard level course which he would be teaching that semester at Georgetown University whose topic was about the life and thought of St. Augustine of Hippo. Instead of being limited to the paid registrants, he decided to see what would happen if he opened it to the world online. In a time when the first graphical Web browsers, Mosaic (NCSA Mosaic which was later renamed Netscape Navigator) had just been released and network connections were uncommon, his course used ‘primitive’ technology. Gopher, an early Internet protocol, was used to deliver the syllabus and texts. Discussion occurred via a Listserv e-mail list. The course was promoted using several e-mail lists of people with interests similar to the humanist course content. O’Donnell reported that 500 people signed up. He utilized his advanced tuition-paying students to summarize and post content from the F2F seminars, which served to start the online discussions. The participation in the course varied. “Hundreds listened, a few dozen participated, a couple of dozen participated very actively, including some remarkable people” 

But the term ‘MOOC’ was coined in 2008 by Dave Cormier and Bryan Alexander in response to an earlier open online course that had been designed and led earlier that year by George Siemens and Stephen Downes called "Connectivism and Connective Knowledge. Cormier and Alexander’s MOOC had 25 tuition-paying students at the University of Manitoba, Canada, in addition to 2,300 other students from the public who took the online class free of charge for no credit. The course content was available through RSS feeds, and participants used threaded discussions in the Moodle LMS, blog posts, Second Life (a virtual world), and synchronous online meetings.

More important than who stuck their MOOC flag into the ground is that the move to much larger and more open courses that were less concerned with grades, credits, degrees and institutions had arrived.


Gimme a C. Gimme an X.

In that classic sports cheer tradition of "Gimme a [letter]" ending in "What's that spell?"  I want to spend a bit of time on the letters C and X which actually spell the two types of MOOCs we see being used today.

Tony Bates, for his open textbook Teaching in a Digital Age, is including a section on MOOCs and the differences in philosophy and practice between xMOOCs and cMOOCs.

In his textbook, Bates discusses how technology has changed knowledge. He mentions how Socrates criticised writing because it did not lead to "true" knowledge which came only from verbal dialogue and oratory. A clear case of someone stuck in their pedagogy and not open to new technology.

Clearly, writing is an important record of knowledge and way to transmit knowledge. The idea of "writing to learn" is also an established practice in academia.

Bates says that, "Now we have other ways to record and transmit knowledge that can be studied and reflected upon, such as video, audio, animations, and graphics, and the Internet does expand enormously the speed and range by which these representations of knowledge can be transmitted... Maybe this will eventually lead to a ‘knowledge revolution’ equivalent to the age of enlightenment. But I do not believe we are there yet..."

I have written about the differences between the C and X MOOC types too and my own belief (the basis for my own MOOC chapter in a forthcoming book) is that MOOCs are still evolving in their design.

The earliest MOOCs are now referred to a cMOOCs, but the xMOOC design is the dominant design format right now.

xMOOCs use LMS or CMS software that allows for large registrations, storage and and streaming of content and ways to assess and grade student performance. They use the video lectures common to many smaller online courses. They often are designed in lengths similar to traditional semesters. Due to the large enrollments, assessments may be automated, machine-scored or use peer reviews. Like traditional learning online and in a classroom, the courses have assignments. Students may be placed in groups.  

Obviously, this xMOOC model of learning is focused on the transmission of information rather than direct interaction between an individual participant and the instructor that we are used to in F2F learning and also in the better online courses..


cMOOCs turn much of the content creation to contributions from the participants with an emphasis on networking. Stephen Downes has taught in the MOOC setting since the very beginning.

Bates notes Downe's four key design principles for cMOOCs as:
autonomy of the learner(choosing what content or skills they wish to learn) , learning is personal, and thus there being no formal curriculum
diversity in both the tools used and in the participants and their knowledge levels
interactivity co-operative learning, networking between participants
openness in access to the course, but also in using open content, activities and assessment


Think about the transmission of information, the xMOOC is rooted in the expert gives information they have selected to novices, but the cMOOC takes the center away from the instructor and gives it to the learners.


Historically, the "c" stands for Connectivist and the learning theory of connectivism was developed largely by one of the original MOOC instructors, George Siemens. His theory posits that learning happens within a network. Using the digital platforms of the time (2008) -blogs, wikis, social media -  Siemens and Downes used these platforms to teach a course on Connectivism that allowed learners to connect and construct knowledge.

Is one of these two formats superior? they serve different purposes. the xMOOC is more popular probably because it is closer to the traditional online learning that has more history and it feels close to what classroom teachers have been doing for centuries.

Connectivism is fairly new as an approach to teaching, less familiar and perhaps harder to "justify" in academia. The latter is especially true if you want the MOOC to operate in a way that fits typical grading for credit situations. 

Either way, MOOCs spell an evolution in digital learning and it is likely that other branches will form with other approaches to online learning.


cMOOC and xMOOC: Will They Blend?

dual layer
Ever visited the WillItBlend.com site? They literally blend things - like iPhones. They have powerful blenders, but they would not be able to blend the two types of Massive Open Online Courses.

George Siemens, a MOOC pioneer who is still deeply involved in them, wrote recently that is planning a MOOC for this fall (Data Analytics & Learning on edX), the topic of xMOOCs & cMOOCs and possibility of blending the two types was discussed.
His conclusion on that?

I’ve concluded that cMOOCs and xMOOCs are incompatible. They cannot be blended. Pedagogically and philosophically, they are too different. It’s like trying to make a cat a dog. Entertaining, perhaps, but a fruitless venture.
That doesn't mean he has given up on some redesign. Siemens suggests that the two can work "as parallel tracks where learners can navigate from one approach to another."

xMOOCs are the most popular now with the big MOOC providers (like Coursera and EdX) with module-based courses and traditional test-based assessments. It is impossible for a MOOC to be instructor-centered, but the design of the instruction and delivery is still much in control by the instructor(s).
In a cMOOC, the technology should a learner-centered system. That is harder to do with tens of thousands of learners.

Matt Crosslin (who participated in Siemens' "DesignJam") suggests that perhaps one day a platform will be able to offer a course that presents a learner with the option of choosing their path.
Maybe at some point an Artificial Intelligence data-driven program will even be able to recommend the path for them. Learners would enter one of the two paths and follow the paradigm presented. At any time that the learners on the cMOOC track need help (or at some point, when the AI data identifies a need), they can be directed towards the appropriate part of the xMOOC track for help. At any time the learners on the xMOOC track start to get comfortable with the idea of interacting with others (or the AI data identifies this), they can move into the cMOOC track.


Chatting About MOOCs With Stephen Downes

This is the log (slightly cleaned up) from a chat session held today with MOOC pioneer Stephen Downes and participants on the online class "Academia and the MOOC"

Kenneth Ronkowitz

Stephen co-taught that first MOOC, "Connectivism and Connective Knowledge," which had twenty-five tuition-paying students at the University of Manitoba in addition to 2300 other students from the public who took the online class free of charge for no credit. The course content was available through RSS feeds, and participants used threaded discussions in Moodle (LMS), blog posts, Second Life (a virtual world), and synchronous online meetings. 6:43 pm

Stephen Downes

T -5 minutes 6:55 pm

Mary Zedeck

Hi Stephen! 6:55 pm

Stephen Downes

OK, I`m set - it has been ages since I`ve done a text chat 7:00 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

I feel like some kind of Mac vs. Windows battle has been created with the cMOOC vs. the xMOOC. Is this useful or harmful? (or does it just confuse & frighten newbies?) 7:01 pm

Stephen Downes

Mostly it just confuses newbies. It's not really harmful, as the xMOOCs will gradually evolve to become more like cMOOCs - witness Coursera's new 'teacher support' announcement today. But it won't matter because the companies won't survive too long; they'll most likely be acquired by Pearson o Blackboard 7:02 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

I'm not sure if the average MOOC participant(if there is such a thing) is even aware of this distinction? 7:03 pm

Stephen Downes

Probably not 7:03 pm

Caryn N

is cMOOC or xMOOC still an acronym? 7:03 pm

Caryn N

kind of confuses things a little, imho 7:03 pm

Stephen Downes

The experience of course is different, tho - they certainly notice when they're in a cMOOC - but there isn't much crossover from xMOOC to cMOOC, I don't think 7:03 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

there are plenty more in the acronym soup now 7:03 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

Are you currently teaching a MOOC? 7:04 pm

Stephen Downes

MOOC = 'Massive Open Online Course', cMOOC = 'connectivist MOOC', xMOOC = 'eXtended MOOC'     7:04 pm

Denise Kreiger

Stephen, when you say the "companies won't survive too long" are you talking about Coursera and Udacity?   7:04 pm

Stephen Downes

Not teaching one right now, maybe this fall (buit with National Research Council's new mandate to serve business only, it gets harder) 7:05 pm

Stephen Downes

Coursera and Udacity, yes 7:05 pm

Denise Kreiger

won't survive? 7:05 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

because universities will take over? 7:05 pm

Stephen Downes

They're too small, they're too new and inexperienced, and the mainstream LMS companies have a huge advantage over them 7:06 pm

George Meghabghab

Are you saying edX will make it 7:06 pm

Denise Kreiger

But Ed-X is university -based, no? 7:06 pm

JH Shannon

the only universities with the resources bases to do that are those with great research bases, more likely the big higher Ed publishing houses will jump into the content development and perhaps delivery side 7:06 pm

Stephen Downes

EdX has a better chance if it attracts an open source community, but there is the danger of it becoming niche, like Sakai 7:07 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

Isn't the signature track that Coursera is offering a valid long term monetization strategy? 7:07 pm

Stephen Downes

MOOCs don't dfepend on content publishing - that's one of the myths that the new MOOC companies propagate, that MOOCs must be developed from the ground up at great cost - but in fact, MOOCs arfe the ideal vehicle for using existing open educational resources - just the way they linked to a bunch of my resources in this chat area before the chat started 7:08 pm

Mary Zedeck

From your experience teaching MOOCs, what do you think is the most difficult part for the instructor? And, what is the most difficult part for the students? 7:08 pm

Stephen Downes

The signature track is Coursera's best bety - but it's too easy to commoditize 7:08 pm

Stephen Downes

Thinking... 7:09 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

about signature track http://blog.coursera.org/post/?40080531667/signaturetrack 7:09 pm

Stephen Downes

For students, it is and always has been a combination of motivation and finding the time 7:09 pm

Stephen Downes

For instructors, it varies 7:10 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

Personally, I think many of the "issues" academics have with MOOCs are ones that have been discussed about online learning in generals for a few decades (such as academic integrity, encouraging engagement) What are issues that are unique to MOOCs? I'm thinking it's more about grades (peer grading etc.), credits... 7:10 pm

Stephen Downes

The xMOOCs demand a lot of instructor time as they make 80 or so 5 minute videos 7:10 pm

Stephen Downes

The cMOOCs can be crazy and chaotic and for instructors the realization that they don't control the course can be difficult to deal with 7:11 pm

Stephen Downes

For xMOOCs the issues are your straightforward issues - quality control, keeping students interested and active, assessment and credentials 7:12 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

cMOOCs demand a lot of effort from participants to engage within the community. Do you foresee this as a drawback from getting truly "massive" cMOOCs? Just not enough motivated learners? 7:12 pm

Stephen Downes

cMOOCs don't worry about any of that, because cMOOCs allow anyone to bring in resources, let participants choose & select quality resources for themselves, support various degrees of participation, and don't really worry about assessment    7:12 pm

Wendy Gilbert

This is my first MOOC -- and first "chat class." My question is, we have been hearing about MOOCs for a few years now -- why are they suddenly SO popular in the media? 7:13 pm

Stephen Downes

They are suddenly so popular in the media because people with the right media contacts and PR departments launched some 7:14 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

The NY Times needed an end of year article for the education section and decided 2012 was "the year of the MOOC" ;-)   7:14 pm

Wendy Gilbert

Aha... 7:14 pm

Stephen Downes

Anything that demands effort will have trouble attaining mass participation, but that's ok, the goasl isn't to be massive (anything over 150 will work fine) the goal is to be open, accessible and personal 7:14 pm

Wendy Gilbert

We are starting to use the phrase "I am 'MOOCed' out" because we are bombarded with articles about MOOCs. 7:14 pm

Denise Kreiger

When offering a MOOC 'for credit' (cMOOC or xMOOC),' how do you offer a comparable quality learning experience for students where their work will be evaluated to see if they've met the outcomes = course credit? With thousands of students, it's difficult to 'manage' that many students and evaluate their work (including discussion boards which are unwieldy) - and peer-evaluation does not seem a comparable evaluation for course credit. 7:14 pm

George Meghabghab

A project based MOOC is the answer ( I am thinking in the sciences) 7:15 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

Project based MOOCs.. interesting. 7:15 pm

George Meghabghab

I am developing one for my college as a pilot. I am doing a project based MOOC. 7:16 pm

Stephen Downes

@Denise - even if I were teaching an xMOOC, I wouldn't be trying to 'manage' students, or for that matter, much of the learning process at all - because management at scale becomes either inefficient (you tend to manage more poorly, because you don't know individual people) or impossible (because you can't get to know that many people) 7:16 pm

Caryn N

one of the MOOCs I took had a lab exercise, but it only used "household items" - it was very interesting! 7:16 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

I said up front that this "course" was not a course but a Conversation with most of the trad course stuff left out (assignments, grades...) Is that a use of MOOC platforms you see occurring more? 7:17 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

I was thinking about the sciences as well... most cMOOCs that I've looked at have been on education related topics, attracting people largely within academia.. how will the cMOOC framework translate to a science/math course that traditionally requires a lot of "instruction" and "testing"? Really curious about this one. 7:18 pm

Denise Kreiger

@Stephen - then how do you offer MOOCs for course credit and have it be transferable-worthy to other colleges and universities? 7:18 pm

Stephen Downes

My own take on course credit is that it's irrelevant. We have software now that can examine your work and determine whether you are qualified. People will do more and more of their work online. Over time, this will become mainstream. Course credits and academic credentials will become pointless, as work evaluation systems will examine your academic work directly, with each employer using a different set of criteria, and assigning 

you a different grade deopending on their needs and interests 7:18 pm

George Meghabghab

MOOCs are here to stay whether you play or not. The content is free on youtube, Khan's academy. You cannot just delete that. 7:18 pm

Stephen Downes

Lab exercises for MOOCs - there will be a long-term demand for physical learning facilities 7:19 pm

Caryn N

re: the sciences on MOOCs - one tool that is used is ALEKS (http://www.aleks.com/) 7:19 pm

Rob Straby

Stephen, your thoughts about credit are interesting, what do you think of the Mozilla Badge project? Is this a viable or desirable option? 7:20 pm

Caryn N

re: physical learning facilities - that also raises concerns about the "internationalization" of these MOOCs, yes? iow, we might have great facilities in areas of the US, but that's not necessarily true around the world  7:20 pm

Stephen Downes

Eg. I just learned yesterday how to make cheese sauce using sodium citrate - but who keeps Spdium Citrate around? Better to go to a fully stocked food preparation learning centre and try it out (http://www.chow.com/recipes/30?493-perfectly-melting-cheese)  7:20 pm

George Meghabghab

edX offered a "hardware" course without labs. It was only electronic simulation. And very successful.. 7:21 pm

Stephen Downes

@George - yes, the content is free. People don't realize this. This was the basic insight behind cMOOCs, in 2008 (well, one of them). We realized we didn't have to 'design' a course, we just needed to weave together a network of related resources. Which is, after all, connectivism. 7:22 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

Generally potential students are confused by all the MOOC providers - though they may only know the big 3. This also happens with OER. Would it be helpful to have one aggregation point for MOOC registration - or is that too "one world" monopolistic? 7:22 pm

Javier Benítez

Do you foresee learning analytics becoming more robust in assessing the learners in courses online? 7:22 pm

Stephen Downes

There's so much free content- there were millions of resources before Khan, millions since. It's like poeople have no idea. cMOOCs, once people realize how they're built, will become mainstream, because they make use of existing content. (= no cost) 7:22 pm

Stephen Downes

@Rob I haven't pursued badges with any sort of vigour 7:23 pm

Mohamed Khadim

What's the difference between MOOC and the flipped classroom.? Is it the sheer numbers? Or is it that there is still physical contact with instructors and students in an actual classroom ? 7:23 pm

Stephen Downes

@Caryn - I agree re:internationalization - but the content and instruction have always been the really expensive part, and MOOCs eliminate most of that cost 7:23 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

@Mohamed, I think flipped classrooms are a more blended learning approach, with actual physical classes to complement the online learning materials. 7:24 pm

Stephen Downes

@George - yeah, I've seen a lot of 'lab' courses using simulations. That's one area for significant future growth. Unfortunately, building sims is high overhead. It's a place publishers will focus on, and generate good return. 7:25 pm

Susan Dixon

I always thought with all the FREE content ...why do we spend so much time re-inventing the wheel. We need a revolution!  7:25 pm

George Meghabghab

That is why Pearson is working with EdX. 7:26 pm

Stephen Downes

@Javier - learning analytics will be useful, to a degree, but run squarely into privacy and security problems (eg., do you want people being trained for corporate or military learning submitting their analytiocs to Google (or their subsidiary overseas)? 7:26 pm

Stephen Downes

In a MOOC, instructional activities take place online (like today's event, for example). And they're open. In a flipped classroom, instructional activities take place offline, in a classroom, and they're closed. 7:27 pm

Susan Dixon

What is GraRSShopper? 7:28 pm

Stephen Downes

@Susan - exactly. The big lesson people should have learned from Khan is that the content can be pretty low quality and still be useful. I watched a video today to repair my web radio station - I had to set up a YP Hash - and it had no sound or anything, and minimal guidance - but it was the quiclkest & most effocient eway to address my problem 7:29 pm

Mary Zedeck

but you figured it out yourself - with no instruction from a teacher 7:30 pm

Stephen Downes

gRSShopper is software I authored in order to support cMOOCs - I think it's the only cMOOC sofwtare that exists (though people can use WordPress with some plugins to get some of the effect, that's what ds106 does)  

7:30 pm

JH Shannon

Then is not that the question vis-à-vis the relationship between books and higher Ed, the differentiation between higher level learning and simply figuring out how to do something? 7:30 pm

Stephen Downes

@Mary - I figured it out for myself, using the video, with no teacher, yes. Which tells me that having a teacher for this would have been inefficient. 7:31 pm

Javier Benítez

Besides having a set length of time, what are the advantages of having a "course"? Can't we just put all the content online and let people interact with it whenever they like? Thanks 7:31 pm

Mohamed Khadim

I think MOOCs can be quite useful from an accessibility perspective once the student is able to overcome some of the overwhelmingly technical barriers. For example not everyone may be comfortable with a chat session and this creates barrier. How does one approach differentiation from a technology perspective. 7:31 pm

Mary Zedeck

@Stephen, then why school? 7:31 pm

Rob Straby

Which plugins support a MOOC delivery in WordPress? 7:31 pm

Stephen Downes

@JH - a couple of things: first, formal learning tends to be knowledge-oriented (deep enquiry, and all that), while informal learning tends to be task-oriented (I need to know x to do y) 7:32 pm

Stephen Downes

One of the things offering a course did was to make the informal learning a bit less task-based, and to foster reflection over a series of activities and events, promoting the deeper form of learning 7:33 pm

Roz Hussin

@Stephen, have you seen any GOOD qualitative studies YET done on MOOC outcomes? 7:33 pm

Javier Benítez

is informal learning equivalent to tacit knowledge? 7:33 pm

Stephen Downes

@Mohamed - that was key for us - we set up our MOOCs to allow people to participate with any online technology they were comfortable with (in contrast to the platform-based xMOOCs, which demand you adapt to their approach) - because people have different issues with different tech 7:34pm

Stephen Downes

@Rob the major one is FeedPress 7:34 pm

JH Shannon connected 7:35 pm

Stephen Downes

@Javier No, informal learning is not tacit knowledge, though the two are often spoken of as the same thing - informal learning is learning that takes place onm an occasional basis, without a structure or plan, while tacit knowledge is knowledge that is ineffable, that is, knowledge that cannot be expressed in language or visual images 7:36 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

Mary posted a link to "I’m Still Confused as to Why Lecture Hall Classes Are Bad and xMOOCs Are Good? http://tinyurl.com/br83eu2   How would you answer that question? 7:36 pm

Javier Benítez

I think it's difficult to have people buy in to the connectivist learning theory because they've depended so much on textbooks for knowledge. what are the advantages you see in a connectivist learning theory that's not present in others?  7:37 pm

Stephen Downes

(Most of our knowledge is tacit knowledge, very little of what we know is explicit and expressible - which is why learning based on memory is insufficient, you miss most of what an expert knows - and why part of the MOOC model (well, the cMOOC model) is based on immersion into an authentic environment 7:37 pm

Stephen Downes

) 7:37 pm

Mohamed Khadim

Is there a worry that individuals with means in the developing and third world countries may exploit the free offering because they have access to computers and telecommunications while an entire village may not. How does a university avoid potential exploitation. 7:38 pm

Javier Benítez

I really like that about the cMOOC model 7:38 pm

Stephen Downes

@Kenneth Lecture Hall classes are bad because they do not have the support of a major public relations campaign and marketing; xMOOCs are 'good' because they do. (tongue-in-cheek) 7:38 pm

Roz Hussin

@Stephen - clarification on "qualitative studies" - has anyone looked at the impact of MOOCs on how people have changed their interaction style/efficiency after engaging in successful cMOOCs? 7:38 pm

Stephen Downes

@Mohamed - yes there is - I remember when OLPC (One Laptop Per Child) was first being launched, there was concern that the wealthy people in the communities would steal the laptops from the children and would use them for themselves 7:39 pm

Stephen Downes

@Mohamed - of course, this isn't just a problem in the developing world - in North America the wealthy people attend their own very expensive universities where they learn from high-priced professors and forge a business network that will serve them over a lifetime - giving them, for example, access to public relations and media campaigns should they launch a new product or service   7:40 pm

Stephen Downes

@Roz good question - Rita Kop may have mentioned it, but I can't say for sure 7:41 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

There was an interesting paper by Rita Kop on the challenges of connectivist learning in MOOCs, worth a read. http://www.irrodl.org/index.ph?p/irrodl/article/view/882 7:41 pm

Caryn N

The other concern with access is internet access, correct? It's one thing to have a laptop, it's another to be able to connect to a website with the bandwidth that's necessary to view the videos 7:41 pm

George Meghabghab

And now these same universities are offering courses free to the public while only the rich and famous could afford them. 7:42 pm

JH Shannon

@Stephen what do you think will be the longer-term impact of hoax 7:42 pm

JH Shannon

MOOCs on higher ed 7:42 pm

Stephen Downes

@George - yes, they give the courses away - but people go to Yale or Stanford (etc) not for the courses, but for the social, business and political connections - you pay a lot of money for that, and they're not giving *that* away 7:42 pm

Denise Kreiger

Having to do with the "Why Lecture Halls are Bad; xMOOCs are Good" article, I have a concern about the instructional design of MOOCs - if the lectures are chunked and moved online - the MOOC can still resemble the traditional lecture-based model that we're trying to move away from in universities - towards more engaging student-centered learning. Looking at resources in a cMOOC doesn't make a course 'engaging and collaborative 

with deep learning and critical thinking' necessarily, does it? 7:43 pm

Stephen Downes

@Caryn - internet access is a huge issue - I just talked with a group of administrators working at University College of the North, in Manitoba, where many communities don't have roads connecting them to the outside world, where services are minimal, and internet is onbly available by dial-up or satellite - it really changes the dynamics - my thinking here was, focus on what makes MOOCs (cMOOCs, at least) work - create mechanisms for creation and interaction, even if you have to fly DVDs full of content back and forth 7:44 pm

Caryn N

that's an interesting idea - media on the fly! 7:45 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

@Stephen, based on the Kop paper I just linked, she mentions the need for "critical literacies" to engage in cMOOCs. While we're on the topic of the developing world (I come from India), I can't imagine how learners from my country would actually engage with cMOOCs, as the "instructivist" approach is so deeply ingrained within the learning culture here. At the same time, if we look at some of the data on xMOOCs, Indians make up the largest contingent of learners (after the US/Britain).. any comment? 7:46 pm

Roz Hussin

@stephen - what is your opinion on the current LANGUAGE divide? that MOOCs only benefit the English speaking world right now? 7:46 pm

Stephen Downes

@Denise - you're exactly right - the resources are not what make the MOOC (either cMOOC or xMOOC) and it is a mistake to focus too much on them. I call them the McGuffin - the thing that catches people's interest, and makes them want to follow the story, but something inherently meaningless and interchangeable - what makes a MOOC work are the connections and interactions - a community of people working throught he ideas and conceptrs for themselves 7:46 pm

Javier Benítez

@Stephen is learning in a cMOOC just a display of understanding the content? 7:46 pm

George Meghabghab

You can use a translator and view the whole content in your language. 7:47 pm

Mohamed Khadim

@Stephen - perhaps a governance model may emerge that will Address issues of access, hoax, quality, deep instruction etc. or perhaps individual universities have already developed governance and qualitative evaluation models. 7:47 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

@George, yes you can view the content, but can you actually participate? Surely learning is more than just viewing content. 7:47 pm

Maribel Pepe

Of course you have a good connection speed help, but we have found that the most important is access to content, students often go to a cyber if they have problems at home with Connect 7:48 pm

Stephen Downes

@Janesh - I've seen some evidence of the deeply ingrained instructivist nature myself - I remember doing a tywo-day seminar in Malaysia - the first day they all sat and waited for me to teach them, the second day, my instruction to them was, basically, 'teach yourselves' - I have them an assignment, a project, and in groups they needed to work it out 7:48 pm

Susan Dixon

Stephen ... Are cMOOCs "Montessori Gone Wild" for big people? O_O 7:48 pm

Stephen Downes

MOOCs can have that effect - the 'critical literacies' Kop talks about related to a course we taughht, where participants are given the basic tools they need in order to learn for themselves 7:49 pm

Rob Straby

Stephen, your piece on Internet access is key, access is a real issue in northern and rural Canada. I worked on a hybrid project for northern communities, we used WordPress as it was functional on a dial-up connection. I think we need to be sensitive to the technology issues on the learner side. 7:50 pm

Roz Hussin

@Stephen and @Janesh - I am working on a qualitative research project (in hope of) mapping out Connectivist literacies needed for engaging in cMOOCs... Would you have any advice/input? and/or better yet, can I contact you to get advice/input? 7:50 pm

Stephen Downes

just a display of understanding the content? No - unless you thing of 'understanding' very broadly - to me, learning is literally the formation of a series of connections in the brain, learning X is literally forming a set of connections such that the cognitive capacities of a student of X are relevantly similar to those of an expert in X, where relevant similarity can be measured through a comparison of the totality of their interactions of 

practitioners of X, artifacts having to do with X, and performance of functoions related to X 7:51 pm

Denise Kreiger

How does a university offering MOOCs deal with all the digital-divide issues on a global scale so that students can communicate, access/view content, and 'create' content - not just 'consume'? 7:52 pm

Stephen Downes

students often go to a cyber if they have problems at home with Connect -- cybercafes are one of the world's great invention - they are essential in many areas of the world (coffee optional but nice) 7:52 pm

Maribel Pepe

@Stephen Thanks. As the number of participants in the MOOC, how many (number) of teachers or assistants must have? 7:52 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

@Roz, not sure if I can be of any help, but I'll do whatever I can janesh.sanzgiri@gmail.com 7:52 pm

George Meghabghab

Speaking of digital divide: Students own smartphones 2 to 1 compared to Faculty. 7:53 pm

Stephen Downes

@Rob, yes, I am sensitiv e - that's why for example in addition to having live video chats, I broadcast an audio feed on my radio station - because people using mobile phones can access shoutcast and listen to the class, even if they don't have good internet 7:53 pm

Stephen Downes

phew, was falling behind there 7:54 pm

Denise Kreiger

:-) 7:54 pm

Stephen Downes

@Marfibel, there's no number that I've observed, we've always taught MOOCs with three or four people, plus weekly guests, but I imagine it could be done with less (but there's never really a reason to, there always seems to be someone willing to step up and help out) 7:55 pm

Maribel Pepe

@Stephen thanks 7:56 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

To be honest, I am quite sceptical about cMOOCs being popular in India, it will require a major paradigm shift in order to do so. In fact, most of the participants in the "xMOOCs" from India can be attributed to the "big name universities" and the additional line it might add to their CV. 7:56 pm

Stephen Downes

@Geworge - absoluetly, and they don't use email or the web in anything like the numbers older people do - part of the core design fro cMOOCs (but not xMOOCs) was to be platform-agnostic, so we supported and encouraged people to use Twitter, Facebook, Posterous, Tumbly, whatever 7:56 pm

Rob Straby

ShoutCast, great idea, I like how you adapt material so that it can be accessed in multiple sources! 7:57 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

It's great to read about pedagogical innovations and experimentation such as connectivism, but this is quite a long way from reaching fruition in the developing world, where access to a basic education itself is always not granted. 7:57 pm

Stephen Downes

Hard to say Janesh - the people from India I've spoken to have been enthusiastic - I take your point about the line in the c.v. but at a certain point it becomes about what you know and can do, not just your c.v. 7:58 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

Yes, I am just generally very pessimistic :-) 7:59 pm

Maribel Pepe

@Stephen How do we encourage participants to create learning networks? 7:59 pm

Susan Dixon

I tried to register for your course...It says the site is not open to new registrations. ??? 7:59 pm

Stephen Downes

@Rob I use windows 'stereo mix' as my default audio source for everything, put up with a little microphone echo in my earphones, and stream out the same audio feed to Shoutcast, Hangout (or Skype, or Elluminate, depending on what I'm suing), and Audacity (for the recording) 8:00 pm

Stephen Downes

@Susan I'm not doing any courses right now, that's why 8:00 pm

Mohamed Khadim disconnected 8:00 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

We are coming up to the one hour point and I don't want Stephen to get trapped here - Last chance for questions? 8:00 pm

Caryn N

It also seems like many of the courses that have been developed are very university/intellectually minded (i.e. physics, algebra, etc) - any idea why there aren't more practical MOOCs (i.e. how to grow a really great crop, or organizing a grass-roots movement, etc) 8:00 pm

Stephen Downes

But you don't need to register, all the materials (including videos and recordings) are available on the website 8:00 pm

Caryn N

I should have put "practical" in quotes... 8:01 pm

Rob Straby

@Janesh, I have Canadian students with similar issues. I deliver a constructivist approach that I feel is in between connectivist and instructivist models. The reflective projects help to lead students in a more self directed way.  8:01 pm

Denise Kreiger

Roz Hussin

@Maribel, in my humble opinion, based on first hand experience watching learning networks start out strong, then sizzle out, it isn;t about engaging or starting... the key is to SUSTAIN the learning network... 8:01 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

Thankyou Stephen for taking time out to do this. And Kenneth for organizing :-) 8:01 pm

Stephen Downes

@Caryn - because they're not needed - people just Google what they need to know - if they want lessons, they just search specifically for videos 8:01 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

It has been very active here - imagine if a few hundred people DID show up! 8:02 pm

Stephen Downes

@Rob interestingly I have the most problems with teachers who are constructivists - they want my course to be completely conmstructivist, but of course when people define their own learning path, it isn';t 8:02 pm

Stephen Downes

@Kenneth if a few hundred people showed up I would have tyuped as many answers as I did today, but more people would have read them :) 8:03 pm

Roz Hussin

@Kenneth, I think some people got lost in the time zone difference... 8:03 pm

Janesh Sanzgiri

Glad I stayed up for this :-) 8:03 pm

Stephen Downes

Thanks everyone, this has been a lot of fun - can I ask the organizers whether there will be an archive of this chat available in open access somewher? 8:03 pm

Roz Hussin

yes, archive would be GREAT! 8:04 pm

Mary Zedeck

I will create a chat archive and send it to you Stephen 8:04 pm

Stephen Downes

@Kenneth - the trick is to not feel oblicated to answer 400 questions, or even to read them all 8:04 pm

Stephen Downes

The expert is just one person in the conversation 8:04 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

we could post it - what do you think would be a good place for it? 8:04 pm

Roz Hussin

"the trick is to not feel obligated to answer 400 questions, or even to read them all" .... this sounds like a MOOC literacy too! 8:04 pm

Stephen Downes

I can post it on my blog 8:05 pm

Mary Zedeck

And, post the chat archive in the course as well. Feel free to post it to you blog as well, Stephen. 8:05 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

@Roz put it in our MOOC aphorisms!  8:05 pm

Kenneth Ronkowitz

I will also blog it on mine at http://serendipity35.net 8:06 pm

Stephen Downes

OK, archive is openly posted here: http://halfanhour.blogspot.ca/?2013/05/cn1376-acadmooc.html 8:07 pm